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Author Topic: Edge property editing problems..  (Read 5155 times)

vobla

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Edge property editing problems..
« on: February 01, 2008, 03:42:54 pm »

Hi,

I bumped in to a wall for a while while modeling, but I found edge properties to be a solution.
So, I opened a new "playground" project and I can't make edge properties work like shown here:
http://www.anim8or.com/manual/4_object_editor.html#edge_editing

I can crease the sphere, but I am unable to round the cube corners ;(

Tnx.
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Kubajzz

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Re: Edge property editing problems..
« Reply #1 on: February 01, 2008, 05:01:55 pm »

If you want an edge to be rounded, the "smooth" option has to be selected in the edge properties dialog box.
If it still appears creased, doubleclick the mesh and set the "smooth angle" value to a higher number (you will have to enter "90" or higher for the cube because all the angles are rectangular).

Another solution is to subdivide the cube (that's what the manual describes). Select the cube and click Build>Subdivide faces (you can play with the "rounded" value of each edge to set how it will look after subdivision)

The first method only makes the cube look rounded, but it's still a simple mesh consisting of only 8 points and the result wil not be very good.
If you want really nice rounded cube as shown in the manual, you need to use subdivision.

Oh, and don't forget to convert the cube to mesh before smoothing it...

I hope it helps...
« Last Edit: February 01, 2008, 05:04:45 pm by Kubajzz »
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hihosilver

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Re: Edge property editing problems..
« Reply #2 on: February 01, 2008, 08:43:21 pm »

Quote
Another solution is to subdivide the cube (that's what the manual describes). Select the cube and click Build>Subdivide faces (you can play with the "rounded" value of each edge to set how it will look after subdivision)

I would NOT advise this at all.  You're right that subdividing the object could be a good solution, but do NOT use subdivide faces.  You want to use "Build>Convert to subdivided..."  The difference here is that with "convert to subdivided" you can return too the original mesh afterwards.  just using "subdivide faces" will make the poly count MUCH higher, and you will lose control of the mesh with such high amounts of polygons.  I would advise not to use "subdivide faces" unless there's a reason you need the extra polys, and only as long as you keep complete control of the mesh.
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Kubajzz

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Re: Edge property editing problems..
« Reply #3 on: February 01, 2008, 08:50:58 pm »

Well, I agree, maybe "Subdivide faces" is not the best solution...

Just one question:

Quote from: hihosilver
The difference here is that with "convert to subdivided" you can return too the original mesh afterwards.
When I use "Convert to Subdivided" command, is it really possible to return to the original mesh?
I've never found a way to return to the non-subdivided shape...
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RudySchneider

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Re: Edge property editing problems..
« Reply #4 on: February 01, 2008, 09:28:34 pm »

Quote from: Kubajzz
I've never found a way to return to the non-subdivided shape...

Provided your mesh was indeed converted to subdivided, simply double-click on your object; the Subdivision Editor dialog box will pop up.  Change the Working and Final Divisions to 0 and 1, respectively.
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Kubajzz

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Re: Edge property editing problems..
« Reply #5 on: February 01, 2008, 09:37:46 pm »

Quote from: Kubajzz
I've never found a way to return to the non-subdivided shape...

Provided your mesh was indeed converted to subdivided, simply double-click on your object; the Subdivision Editor dialog box will pop up.  Change the Working and Final Divisions to 0 and 1, respectively.

Oh, thanks... I thought it's not possible to enter a lower value than 1...

This is great, I've been using anim8or for almost 5 years and I'm still learnig  ;D Thank you once more...
I apologize to vobla for messing up his topic with my stupid question  ::)
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vobla

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Re: Edge property editing problems..
« Reply #6 on: February 01, 2008, 10:33:08 pm »

I apologize to vobla for messing up his topic with my stupid question  ::)

Are you kidding? As long as it's not an offtopic I am happy to see people discussing.

Thank you very much for your answers ;)


EDIT: I was playing around with values and here's something aqward I found while taking these steps:

+ create the cube;
+ convert to subdivided;
+ select all edges and set to round;

Results:

+ Round lvl 1 result - pic 1;
+ lvl2 and 3 results - pic 2; ???
+ lvl 4 results - pic 3;
+ lvl 5, 6, 7 results - pic 4.

Everything looks fine and explainable except round lvl 2 and 3 results ???

ONE MORE EDIT: Hmm.. seems that you can see the difference when applying higher division values, but anyway, these results still look strange to me.

AND EVEN MODE: When you set all edges to creased (taking above mentioned steps), cube transforms in to a perfectly smoothed ball ???
Since I am modeling houses, I need most of edges to be creased and/or slightly rounded..
« Last Edit: February 02, 2008, 01:42:30 pm by vobla »
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vobla

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Re: Edge property editing problems..
« Reply #7 on: February 06, 2008, 11:34:35 pm »

em.. anyone?
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headwax

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Re: Edge property editing problems..
« Reply #8 on: February 06, 2008, 11:50:39 pm »

sorry vobla .... what was the  question you asked?
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CobraSpectre

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Re: Edge property editing problems..
« Reply #9 on: February 07, 2008, 12:10:31 am »

I think vobla is asking about how rounded levels affect what's happening.

I tried doing some tests, here's what I got.

Rounded level on a subdivided object appears to be tied to the subd level.

So if you have subd set on 3, rounded level 1 is rounded but mostly boxy, RL 2 is more boxy (closer to the original shape), RL 3 is the original shape, RL 4 is somewhat boxy but more rounded that RL 1, on up to RL 7 where it looks like the smooth object.

Creased on a subd object appears to have no effect. (can anyone verify?)

One way to have an influence on how subd works is to add control lines. Using the Knife tool to cut lines near the edges of the mesh will change the way subd works. For example, if you cut a line in a cube near the top and bottom, when smoothed it looks more like a cylinder.

Inset and extrusions also affect subdivision. Two small extrudes will smooth differently that one extrude of the same size.
« Last Edit: February 07, 2008, 12:14:36 am by CobraSpectre »
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vobla

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Re: Edge property editing problems..
« Reply #10 on: February 07, 2008, 12:56:48 pm »

Hmm.. I am modeling some buildings so mostly I need creased edges and just some of it slightly rounded. Since creased has no effect all I can think of is I shouldnt conv to subdiv and just bevel edges I want to round till its angle is smaller than 45. Does anyone has better suggestion? (Hope so ;) )
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hihosilver

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Re: Edge property editing problems..
« Reply #11 on: February 07, 2008, 08:06:52 pm »

Use the 'rounded' setting.  Basically what the 'rounded' level does is change how rounded the edges are.  At first this seems incorrect, but when you think about it, it's not.  Smooth makes a smooth transition curving from the vertices.  When you think of creased, don't think of it in the way of edge reinforcement, because really it's not.  Creased just changes how the normals on a model are rendered, that's why it doesn't work with a subdivision object, because crease works with the edges of an individual face.  So that only works with a mesh.  Rounded is what's like edge reinforcement.  The higher the rounded level, the sharper a transition it will make over the edge.  It creases at a certain point because it's turning so sharply that there aren't enough faces to make that sharp of a curve, so it creates a crease.  So, if you have a rounded level of 3, it will crease if the subdivision object is set to 2.  But if you set the subdivision object to 4, there are enough faces to create a rounded yet sharp edge.

I hope this helps explain it a bit.
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vobla

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Re: Edge property editing problems..
« Reply #12 on: February 08, 2008, 12:15:02 am »

I've been playing aroud with smooth and rounded for a while and it seemed to ok as long as the object was simple.
And here comes the big question. Say I want to model a radiator (pic1 - just so you know what I mean). Lets stick to a front part. So I make a model like in pic2. I set subdivision to lvl 3 all the unselected edges round 3 and selected - round 1. Result I get is in a pic3.. Just the middle extrusion look pretty fine..
Did I do something wrong here ???
« Last Edit: February 08, 2008, 12:21:44 am by vobla »
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hihosilver

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Re: Edge property editing problems..
« Reply #13 on: February 08, 2008, 05:59:56 am »

It makes sense it's doing this, and that's because the edges aren't actually reinforced.  So normally when subdivided the object would do something like this, but the edges wouldn't go in as sharply.  The problem is that the corners aren't reinforced.  So they'll be rounded.

Personally I'd advise using the bevel tool instead of changing the edge properties for this.  They can be very useful, but sometimes beveling or using the cut tool is preferred.
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vobla

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Re: Edge property editing problems..
« Reply #14 on: February 08, 2008, 01:01:54 pm »

Tnx
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