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Author Topic: 'p', 'e' and 'g' hot keys  (Read 4979 times)

Steve

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'p', 'e' and 'g' hot keys
« on: January 03, 2015, 12:46:02 am »

nemyax, johnar and others: I've changed the behavior of the 'p', 'e' and 'g' hot-keys to be more like nemyax's To Points, To Edges and To Faces commands (see his post). Here's the current rules:

To Points 'p': Select points in selected faces or edges. Then deselect faces and edges.
To Edges 'e': Select edges in selected faces and their end points. Then deselect faces and all points that are not in a selected edge.
To Faces 'g': Select faces with a selected point or edge. Then deselect points and edges.

I tried an alternate To Edges behavior where any it also selected edges with a selected point. However this seemed to select too much. Also repeating the 'e' command in this manner keeps growing the selection which seems wrong. That doesn't happen for the 'p' and 'g' commands.

Here's the build 1148

Comments appreciated :)
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nemyax

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Re: 'p', 'e' and 'g' hot keys
« Reply #1 on: January 03, 2015, 09:35:25 am »

Steve
Thanks a million!
It would be perfect if "edges to faces" selected the faces that share the edge rather than the points. But I realise that Anim8or doesn't easily decouple edge selections from point selections.
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johnar

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Re: 'p', 'e' and 'g' hot keys
« Reply #2 on: January 03, 2015, 12:26:44 pm »

Firstly, i'd like to say awesome effort steve
 But theres a couple of things i 'think' i can see......

 Probably the first question is: Is this for normal object edit mode only? (not fast select)
 I say that because the buttons change along with the key selection. ie: go 'p' for points, and the edge and face buttons are deselected. Makes fastmode redundant if turned on.
 If its supposed to work in both fast and normal modes, then they'll need to be 'disconnected somehow' for fastmode?

 I've gone through all the functions, one by one, and all working very well except....points to edges seems not quite right.

Quote
I tried an alternate To Edges behavior where any it also selected edges with a selected point. However this seemed to select too much.
Shouldn't these faces,
.
 only select these edges. ? And shouldn't these edges,

  only select these faces  ?


Quote
Also repeating the 'e' command in this manner keeps growing the selection which seems wrong. That doesn't happen for the 'p' and 'g' commands.

I'm a little bit confused here. It  actually does still happen with p to g and  e to g  It grows every time you go from e to g. and from p to g.
 (thats happening here on windows xp)
 I'm not familiar at all with how its handled in wings 3d but think there could be a basic 'something' that curbs this behaviour.
 The small images i've posted above may hold a clue, but, as of yet, i can't see it.....

 You might have said it here:
Quote
it also selected edges with a selected point.
Perhaps an edge should need 2 selected points, (to be selected as an edge), and perhaps a face should require a minimum of (3?) selected points or edges? (to be selected as a face)
 Just my 2 cents so far. Hopefully my 2 cents make some sense. (cents. lol)
« Last Edit: January 03, 2015, 01:18:55 pm by johnar »
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nemyax

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Re: 'p', 'e' and 'g' hot keys
« Reply #3 on: January 03, 2015, 08:04:27 pm »

I'm not familiar at all with how its handled in wings 3d
Wings is different in that only one component type is selectable at a time. Here's what happens.
Edges to faces:


Edges to vertices:


Faces to vertices:


Faces to edges:


Vertices to faces:


Vertices to edges:



I tried an alternate To Edges behavior where any it also selected edges with a selected point. However this seemed to select too much.
I'd say this is the better behaviour. One obvious use is when you want to run a loop through a "star" formation of edges: select a point, convert to edges, connect with j. Right now "points to edges" does nothing.

I'm a little bit confused here. It  actually does still happen with p to g and  e to g  It grows every time you go from e to g. and from p to g.
I think Steve is referring to pressing the same mode key repeatedly. The fact that the selection grows when you alternate the modes is logical and actually useful.

Steve, perhaps you would consider handling conversions from single-type and mixed-type selections differently?
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johnar

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Re: 'p', 'e' and 'g' hot keys
« Reply #4 on: January 04, 2015, 08:44:03 am »

Quote
Quote from: johnar on Yesterday at 12:26:44 pm
I'm not familiar at all with how its handled in wings 3d

 Well, there ya go.
 The wings type system is tried and trusted. I'm only speaking 'off the cuff'.
 Its all pretty neat. Probably should've waited till someone more 'in the know' posted first.
 Could've saved a nonsense rant from me. lol (sorry steve)
Cool. Thanks for that explanation nemyax

 
« Last Edit: January 04, 2015, 11:30:47 am by johnar »
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kreator

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Re: 'p', 'e' and 'g' hot keys
« Reply #5 on: January 04, 2015, 07:40:43 pm »

Is it me? If I have fast focus and fast select disabled I can use the old method of selection? If this is correct then why don`t they toggle off the previous used selection as they used to do.?
« Last Edit: January 04, 2015, 07:41:26 pm by kreator »
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Steve

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Re: 'p', 'e' and 'g' hot keys
« Reply #6 on: January 04, 2015, 09:51:22 pm »

I hadn't intended for the Fast Select setting to alter that. I had several requests to allow selection of Points, Edges and Faces simultaneously.  You can also use the 'T' hot key to cycle through P/E/F/PEF independent of Fast Select.
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Raxx

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Re: 'p', 'e' and 'g' hot keys
« Reply #7 on: January 05, 2015, 06:43:42 am »

I was going to argue in favor with Johnar's expectations of their behavior, but the advanced user can do more with the Wings type selection behavior, even if it makes less logical sense.

I tried an alternate To Edges behavior where any it also selected edges with a selected point. However this seemed to select too much.
I'd say this is the better behaviour. One obvious use is when you want to run a loop through a "star" formation of edges: select a point, convert to edges, connect with j...

As a side remark, you can select a point, hit the bevel tool, then use peak. Advantage is that it lets you choose the length of the cut and automatically move in/out the middle point. I would also suggest to Steve to make point and edge extrusion an automatic extension of extrude faces tool, thereby allowing a single global extrude tool (let it absorb the extrude outer edges tool as well). Also get rid of the extrude connected faces tool and incorporate it into the global extrude tool using the shift key, perhaps.
« Last Edit: January 05, 2015, 07:44:18 am by Raxx »
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nemyax

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Re: 'p', 'e' and 'g' hot keys
« Reply #8 on: January 05, 2015, 08:07:21 am »

the advanced user can do more with the Wings type selection behavior, even if it makes less logical sense
The logic behind it is "make a minimal selection and convert it to what I really want selected". Among other things, this helps you get to components that are hard to get to or obstructed.
In the screenshot below, I really want to select faces for a bridge operation. So I select the shared edges, convert them to faces, deselect the faces I don't want, and BAM.


In johnar's second example, the thinking is "select the same stuff, but in face mode"; this doesn't help much—you could have selected the faces in the first place, and more easily too.
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Raxx

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Re: 'p', 'e' and 'g' hot keys
« Reply #9 on: January 05, 2015, 05:28:19 pm »

Preserving the user's original selection is the more expected outcome when switching between P/E/F modes in isolation. But 'e', 'p', and 'g' isn't traditional mode-switching, it's selection conversion. So long as users can understand that, I have no issue with it.
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Steve

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Re: 'p', 'e' and 'g' hot keys
« Reply #10 on: January 05, 2015, 07:13:31 pm »

OK here's what I have now. It's essentially the same as Wings except that edges still have their end points selected:

points to edges:


points to faces:


edges to points:


edges to faces:


faces to points:


faces to edges:


I'll post an update after I've done a bit more testing.
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thecolclough

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Re: 'p', 'e' and 'g' hot keys
« Reply #11 on: January 05, 2015, 08:43:49 pm »

...here's what I have now...
looks logical to me :)
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nemyax

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Re: 'p', 'e' and 'g' hot keys
« Reply #12 on: January 05, 2015, 09:44:38 pm »

Thanks for the implementation in build 1150, Steve. Vastly appreciated.
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johnar

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Re: 'p', 'e' and 'g' hot keys
« Reply #13 on: January 05, 2015, 10:03:37 pm »

 Points to edges wasn't working before, but build 1150 has fixed that.
 Nice one steve. Awesome.
  Will post if any issues arise.. (real or imagined, lol)
So far, so good...


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