Anim8or Community

General Category => General Anim8or Forum => Topic started by: rellik420 on April 30, 2010, 08:27:58 pm

Title: saving in scene
Post by: rellik420 on April 30, 2010, 08:27:58 pm
well. i lost a few hours worth of work. i tried to animate my figure in scene mode. i was using props in my animation too. everything was going good untill i saved it and came back 2 it. it didnt save the animation for my figure but it saved everything else.

i just tested this again. i moved my guys head saved it and closed anim8or and when i came back to it, same thing. is this normal?

i did pose him in sequence mode. if that matters at all but i animated him scene. please help.
Title: Re: saving in scece
Post by: siragin on April 30, 2010, 08:43:39 pm
Just asking right now but did you push the animate key before you started moving things around? meaning when you was trying to animate was the key green?
Title: Re: saving in scece
Post by: rellik420 on April 30, 2010, 09:00:06 pm
yea. everything worked when i saved it. but when i saved it, closed anim8or and came back to my scene. my guy lost all his keyframes. ill post a video on what im talking about.
Title: Re: saving in scece
Post by: 3Dgeek11 on April 30, 2010, 09:23:03 pm
I really have no idea what happened if he was really working in Scene mode already.

Weird.. :-\ Maybe the video thing will help.
Title: Re: saving in scece
Post by: rellik420 on April 30, 2010, 09:57:45 pm
actions speak louder than words.

Title: Re: saving in scene
Post by: 3Dgeek11 on April 30, 2010, 10:16:09 pm
Huh... That is weird. I'll test on my computer and see what happens. Although it may not be right this second. ;)

P.S. I use CamStudio, too! Awesome program.
Title: Re: saving in scene
Post by: 3Dgeek11 on April 30, 2010, 10:39:10 pm
Here's what happened to me, same thing...


(zipped because I didn't want to upload 29MBs right this second, takes a few minutes. ;) )

P.S. SR. MEMBER>>> Now... what happens? :P
Title: Re: saving in scene
Post by: rellik420 on April 30, 2010, 10:54:31 pm
hopefully some1 will chime in here and tell us whats up. i tested the same thing in .95 i thought it might b a .97 bug. but same thing happend. i searched the forums but i couldnt find anything about it.
Title: Re: saving in scene
Post by: rellik420 on April 30, 2010, 11:23:05 pm
well i think i found the culprit. i tried doing the same thing with the figure only and not useing a sequence in the 1st frame and it saved my keyframes. but im still curious about who what where and why. my next step in my "training" to learn animation im going to use sequences and scene animation in the same scene. so it looks like ill run into the same problem when i get to that point. hopefully some1 can elaborate on the issue. thanks
Title: Re: saving in scene
Post by: ENSONIQ5 on April 30, 2010, 11:34:19 pm
Make sure you have keyframed every bone in the figure in the initial sequence, this should solve the issue.
Title: Re: saving in scene
Post by: ENSONIQ5 on April 30, 2010, 11:44:36 pm
One method of sequence animation I have found successful is "pose sequencing".  Rather than building full motion sequences which can then be a nightmare to integrate into the scene, particularly if you have multiple interacting figures, you build a series of single-frame sequences, each one essentially a single pose.  The tweener engine in Scene mode will interpolate the motion of the bones from one sequence to another.  So for example, to go from a sitting to a standing pose, rather than building a fixed "standing up" sequence you would build a single-frame "sitting" pose sequence, and another single-frame "standing" sequence.  This way you can control the speed of the actual standing up motion in Scene mode by adjusting the position of the sequences.

Crucially, you MUST keyframe every bone in the figure, and this should also be the case for multi-frame sequences, where you should always keyframe every bone in the first and last frames at least (use Edit>Bones>Key all bones).  I have also found it useful to create a "neutral" sequence that puts the figure in the basic "T pose", dropping this sequence into the first frame of a scene ensures all the bones have animation controllers ready to go.
Title: Re: saving in scene
Post by: rellik420 on May 01, 2010, 03:20:22 am
i made my sequence 1 frame key all bones again just 2 make sure i did it. and it still didnt save my scene bone frames. but im definetly going to try out the pose animations. it seems like thats the most logical way to do it. thanks for the info.
Title: Re: saving in scene
Post by: rellik420 on May 01, 2010, 03:24:19 am
how do u put a sequence in a certain frame? if i make keyframe useing the scene mode in frame 1-5 then select frame 10 and input a sequence it deleted what i did in scene mode and replaced it with the sequence. ill look it up but if some1 can help here that would b great
Title: Re: saving in scene
Post by: 3Dgeek11 on May 01, 2010, 04:48:25 am
I don't know about the last question, rellik.

But I forgot to mention:

well i think i found the culprit. i tried doing the same thing with the figure only and not useing a sequence in the 1st frame and it saved my keyframes.

I tried that first and it worked as well. Forgot to say it in my last post.

I never animate in scene mode, because it doesn't automatically change the pose of the object, just the bones. I have to switch to object and back to scene to get it to work.

ESONIQ: That is a great tip. I'll use it often. But I didn't quite understand about the sequences, how do you add more than one to one figure? Just as rellik asked above. ;)
3DGeek
Title: Re: saving in scene
Post by: rellik420 on May 01, 2010, 07:52:11 am
what i did when i made my 1st few sequences was like for my kick test thing. i made him have a stance where he swayed back and forth then my 2nd sequence was the kick itself. after that i went back to my 1st sequence so he went back to the stance. i think what anim8or does is stack the sequences. but ive ran into probelms with that. (im pretty sure its because i didnt set my bone limits) sometimes when u go from sequence to sequence your arm would go the oposite way and like spin around. but drom what ive done so far theres no in between in your frames. so u cant select which frame you want to start your new sequence. but i could be wrong since im all new to this.
Title: Re: saving in scene
Post by: johnar on May 01, 2010, 09:27:18 am
Hi there, :),
 Just to elaborate on a couple of things.
 As ENSONIQ5 has said, making a pose in sequence mode and keying all bones is important, not just for the reasons givin, but also because if you dont, and just activate bones as you need them in scene mode, you'll find yourself having to be constantly scrolling up and down in the time track looking for bones that should be listed next to each other.  ie: head bone x,y,z,, neck bone x,y,z, R shoulder x,y,z,, R forearm x,y,z, R wrist, xyz and so on. 
It can also be really annoying when  the y axis of a bone is listed at top of time track, yet the x and z of the same bone are way further down.
 Making the 'all bones keyed pose', and placing into scene at the beginning, will put all your bones in a much tidier and more easily usable order in the time track.
 (ENSONIQ5  uses a T pose, i use a 'Stand pose'. Same results)

 After that though, its not necessary to key all bones in every subsequent sequence. I make a lot of sequences and key only the bones that are necessary. Ie; I make a walk cycle with legs only.  Legs and feet are keyed, nothing else. His arms are still in default 'T' pose. NO KEYS.  Then, i  have a 'throw' sequence, and only the upper bones are keyed.
 Now, i can add the 'walk legs only' sequence, and then the 'throw' sequence can be added into the same frames. So your character will now throw something while he's walking.
 One place where this is really handy is when animating hands. By making 'pose sequences' of fingers in different positions, its then quick and easy to add 'a lot' of  movement to your characters hands without needing to move the fingers manually every time. The 4 most basic would probably be 'R hand open, L hand open, R hand closed, L hand closed. (4 seperate sequences)
 Just remember to key 'only the hand bones, and nothing else. (key selected bones).

 Good luck guys.
Title: Re: saving in scene
Post by: ENSONIQ5 on May 01, 2010, 11:40:13 am
Quite right about keying only the bones being used in a sequence Johnar, not sure what I was thinking when I posted that!  Rellik, you can make as many sequences for a figure as you like, and you can drop them into any keyframe in Scene mode.
Title: Re: saving in scene
Post by: 3Dgeek11 on May 01, 2010, 07:57:57 pm
I normally do key all the bones, I wish there was a button or something that would do it for you, that'd be helpful and save a lot of time.

But also: If you don't really need to do that, then that's great! But I still don't understand "how" to add different sequences in one scene. It never seems to work.
Thanks for all the posts, you guys! (Even though it's not my topic :P )
Title: Re: saving in scene
Post by: ENSONIQ5 on May 02, 2010, 12:00:24 am
To add another sequence to a scene, just move to the keyframe you want it to start on and click Build>Add Sequence.  There is a menu item to key all the bones in Sequence mode, but unfortunately not in Scene mode.
Title: Re: saving in scene
Post by: 3Dgeek11 on May 02, 2010, 03:06:44 am
Oh, yes, I think I've seen that key button in sequence. So as long as the "sequence" is made in the sequence mode there should be no problems? I'll probably read this post later and realize I was wrong, but whatever. :P

Does it matter if the keyframe I want the next sequence to start on, is already in the middle of another sequence?
Thanks again. =]
Title: Re: saving in scene
Post by: ENSONIQ5 on May 02, 2010, 03:54:02 am
You can drop a sequence into the middle of another sequence for the same figure, but Anim8or will convert the original sequence into keyframes.  This means that editing the original sequence (in Sequence mode) will no longer have any effect on the animation in Scene mode.  It is advisable to avoid doing this where possible, particularly if the same bones are being manipulated in both sequences.  It would be preferable to use either sequences that don't overlap or manipulate the bones directly in Scene mode.
Title: Re: saving in scene
Post by: 3Dgeek11 on May 02, 2010, 05:18:35 am
I didn't say I wanted to, just wonderin'. :)
Thanks 'gain
3DGeek