Anim8or Community

General Category => General Anim8or Forum => Topic started by: Raxx on March 06, 2012, 08:02:29 pm

Title: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: Raxx on March 06, 2012, 08:02:29 pm
Ok! 3D Printer Status update: Calibrated!

Yeah, three months later, I finally have the machine in the state that I want it.

What happened was that in January I had gone through four different firmwares and none gave me stable results. Frustrated, I took a break and focused on school and other projects. Spring Break arrived and now I found out that one of the firmware (Marlin) has gone through a lot of improvements, and the slicer that turns the 3D models into g-code is near perfect, so now I can finally make prints with up layer heights of 0.2 mm! It took a few days to finish calibrating it, and there are a few minor issues, but I have a feeling the problems will smooth over almost by themselves.

With that said, I've got a bit of excess PLA stock left over before I change to ABS, and I wish to offer a gift to the community: I'll print one of your models! I'm willing to do one print each, my offer stands until Friday the 6th of this month. I'm only going to print a maximum of 5 prints from this community. So it's first come first serve!

Some guidelines:

1. It must be completely manifold (no open edges)
2. Stick to the 45 degree rule. If the angle is greater than 45 degrees from the horizontal, it's good for printing. However, if it's less and therefore has too much overhang, there will be a lot more issues evident in the print. Bridging is possible, but limited (for example, if you wanted a bridge printed, the "bridge" part will be the overhang between two pillars, and printing "in air" is possible depending on the distance between the two pillars).
3. If you have a complicated model, it can be split up into smaller pieces for printing, then attached together (I can attach it for you or you can attach it yourself)
4. Naturally I need your mailing address. As far as I care, I'll ship anywhere international or not.

The scale of your print will be determined by me based on your model, but if it needs to be an exact size then know that the printer can't print anything bigger than 190mmx170mmx110mm. I'll give you advice on your model if you have questions or issues with it. I'd like this to be a "public" venture, so please submit your models in this topic so that I can post the progress. If you don't want your models out in the open where anyone can grab them, post a render of it and email me the actual raw model. .obj or .an8 preferred, untriangulated (for easier editing).

I'd offer to airbrush details onto it myself, but I'm not exactly a pro at that yet ;) The most I'll offer is to airbrush one color in gradients to "complement" the details and make it look nice. As you can see by the picture below, it prints out to a nice shiny near-transparent quality which, when painted in minimal color, looks spectacular. Otherwise if you want full color detailing, I recommend plastering over it, sanding it, then painting on the details with acrylic paint and then add a gloss or matte finish to preserve it.

(Janro, Headwax, and ENSONIQ5, I haven't forgotten you guys--give me something to print for you as an extra to compensate for my tardiness!)
[edit above--I meant Janro!]

Available Prints Left: 0

Queue List:
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: $imon on March 06, 2012, 08:42:15 pm
Hey Raxx, congrats on finishing your printer! That's quite the achievement! Would you mind sharing some photo's / video's of the completed printer (in action)? I admire your DIY skills a lot - it sounds like it was a very fun project to make, especially satisfying when the end result is a real working 3d printer! The idea that you won't have to stop with just a virtual representation of your 3d model, but that you can make everything from concept to 3d to real object in your own house is awesome!

If you don't mind I would like to subscribe to one of the prints. It seems like it will require a specialized model though so I think I would like to make something from scratch rather than adjusting a previous model.
Could you elaborate a bit on the 45 degree rule? is this because of the 0.2mm resolution? + what angles in the model will have to be more than 45 degrees?

Again congratulations on finishing it! great job :)
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: cooldude234 on March 06, 2012, 09:06:37 pm
can I reserve a spot?? ???  ???

PLEASSSSSSSEE!!??  ;D
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: Raxx on March 06, 2012, 10:28:15 pm
Ok, you guys are added to...."the list"!

Anyways, to answer your questions $imon, the 0.2mm resolution actually helps the printer work with more extreme angles. However, the 45 degree rule is a safe number commonly used because remember that it's dealing with melted plastic that's extruded at between 0.2-0.5 mm diameter. So as each melted thread gets layered on top of the other, and a more extreme angle means more overhang which means less support for the melted threads on top since it has to go farther and farther out from the threads underneath. The weight of the threads make it start sagging down and become less effective, eventually causing a stringy, ugly mess (sometimes it fixes itself if the threads underneath harden enough to support the weight and the overhang is short, but there's still a small amount of stringy mess at that area underneath the overhang).

(http://the-meadow.net/prusa/uglee.jpg)

This picture shows kind of how each thread (x-ray view, perpendicular to direction thread is going) might sag if there was too much of an angle. The bottom shows what can happen if the angle is too much and things start sagging. The top shows a good angle where there is enough support underneath each thread to maintain the integrity of the structure.

Bridging is different, but I won't go into that right now :P Let's just say that because there's support between two pillars, a thread of melted filament can be extruded across and attached securely enough on the other side of the gap without much if any sag before it hardens.

As for what you want printed, you can slice a pre-existing model into blocks or pieces that don't violate any of the printing restrictions. There's also a method of printing where support can be printed in all the negative space of the object, and the object is popped off or something, but I haven't really investigated it and it spends a lot more filament (sample picture (http://www.mendel-parts.com/media/catalog/product/cache/1/image/9df78eab33525d08d6e5fb8d27136e95/i/m/img_2837_2.jpg))

Below is an example of how you could cut a chess piece for printing. Basically it's cut in half and then the model is printed with the cut ends down. Though in actuality, a whole model of a chess piece like this would probably have no problems in printing, I just used it as an example :P

(http://the-meadow.net/prusa/chesspiececut.jpg)

I'm going to try to post timelapse videos of each of you guys's prints being made. At 0.2mm a print may take up to 24 hours to print, depending on its size (and therefore its number of layers), so it has to be a timelapse vid :P.

Oh yeah, remember I need to have these in by Friday so I have time to print them before school starts!
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: Raxx on March 06, 2012, 10:35:35 pm
One last bit of info. In Anim8or (and most 3D programs), one unit equals 1 millimeter. The maximum print size for one piece is about 190x170x110 mm. This is just to help you visualize the final print size when working on your model.
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: cooldude234 on March 06, 2012, 10:58:54 pm
One last bit of info. In Anim8or (and most 3D programs), one unit equals 1 millimeter. The maximum print size for one piece is about 190x170x110 mm. This is just to help you visualize the final print size when working on your model.

What the hell?!
Really, I've been using one unit as one meter :P
I'm sure that would defiantly exceed your print size, yet alone THE COUNTRY (okay that may be exaggerating a little).

EDIT: I'm assuming the sizes you mentioned are in this order, x(width) z(depth) y(height),
correct I'm wrong/tell if I'm right :P
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: siragin on March 07, 2012, 12:13:54 am
I would love to get one of my models printed if that's possible.
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: Raxx on March 07, 2012, 01:06:00 am
cooldude234, you are correct. Don't fret too much about the size unless you're making something functional in real life, I can always scale it down otherwise.

siragin, you're added to the list. 2 more slots open!
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: Janro on March 07, 2012, 01:55:48 am
Wow, congrats on that 3D printer Raxx! I'm considering having a model of mine printed, I'm not sure if it falls in the requirements though. Will have to check.
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: cooldude234 on March 07, 2012, 01:57:49 am
Question about over those hanges?
Clearly there are going to be some even slight thing over hanging, and I'm sure you know, but is it better to have something thin that is hanging over, or something that is thick?

What is the general thickness of lets say a pole (a lovely example = a boring example :P), till were it becomes too weak and breaks?

EDIT: such as.. if you were making a house, were you have the roof over hanging, you could make it's base 90 degrees, from the side of the house see pic for example, would it work, or would it warp
and etc etc.

EDIT AGAIN: I'm sure in the end I'm going to have to do the infamous stump supporting the statue type of deal, but I want to understand what will and wont work
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: Raxx on March 07, 2012, 05:11:50 am
When I mentioned the angles, I meant the angles from the horizontal (that is, on the x and y axis, with the positive x-axis pointing right as 0, and the angles proceeding counterclockwise from there). So according to that, anything between 45 degrees and 135 degrees from the horizontal is OK.

However, the 90 degrees you have on your house is actually 0 or 180 degrees from the horizontal, which is pretty bad for an extrusion 3D printer to work with. I can just about guarantee it would have ugly results all around where the roof overhangs the base part. It would definitely have to be separated into at least two pieces for it to print successfully.

The plastic, when it hardens, is pretty solid. If you want something to stay rigid without bending from external forces, though, I'd recommend at least a base area of 3mmx3mm. If you wanted it to serve as a pole just for support for odd angles, it's a little iffy and depends on a bunch of factors. If you wanted to print a human with its arms out doing whatever, the arms would have to be positioned so that the supporting poles and the body are no more than, say, 10 mm from each other. Sometimes it'd be easier to just print the arms separately and attach afterwards.

(http://the-meadow.net/prusa/angles2.png)

If any of the contours have an angle within the red, that's bad :P Anything below the horizontal will absolutely need support. Anyway, feel free to post what you've got and we can figure out how to get it printed.


By the way, I didn't really hit on level of detail much. Yes, it'll be 0.2mm layer height.

(http://jstoddardfinalblog.files.wordpress.com/2011/04/bull2.jpg?w=600&h=450)

If that bull were to be printed within 7.5"x6.5"x4.5", which is the max size my printer can print, then all of the details would be fairly evident except for the smaller sharper details like the creases in the eyes and mouth, though you might be able to see it a little bit. If you want really sharp detail on a small figure, you'll have to put clay on it and carve it in, then plaster the rest of the model, sand it down, paint it, and finish it.

I intended on printing a few examples today, but lo' and behold, my hotend's not working. So you guys may end up having more time to work on your models if I need to order a new one :P I'll keep you guys posted.

Oh, and Janro, you're on the list!

Janro doesn't count against the tally, though, so there are still 2 spots open!
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: Raxx on March 07, 2012, 05:42:10 am
And this is the last post I'm going to make about proper contour angles :P It's the most important concept for you guys to understand, but yeah...

(http://the-meadow.net/prusa/meh.png)

I took an image from the 'net and drew an outline of where the good contours are and the bad contours. Green is good, red is bad, blue shows where a support pillar would probably have to be placed. The underside of his jaw probably wouldn't come out too bad
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: Bugtrooper on March 07, 2012, 02:34:35 pm
Great work!
I planned with my friends to make a 3d printer because we learn to be an electrical engineer. Anyway....... Can you help us if I'll have some questions?
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: Janro on March 07, 2012, 02:57:49 pm
Suhweet!

Well I'm glad we have potentially more time to work on our models. I kinda have a lot on my plate as it is. (I'd have a model used in my thesis printed, but alas, my friend modelled it and not I. xD) I guess I'll throw up some studies and ask for their viability for printing soon.

EDIT: For a moment there I thought you actually modelled/sculpted that picture Raxx. Then I read the paragraph that followed xD
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: Raxx on March 07, 2012, 04:45:25 pm
Haha, I wish I had the time to make something like that ;), it's been too long since I just sat down and modeled something for the heck of it...

Ok, so I have news about the hotend (the part that melts the plastic): it's busted. So I ordered a newer, more reliable model and it should arrive within a week. So the deadline for submissions is probably Friday 16th, March, assuming I get it back up and running by then!
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: Mills on March 07, 2012, 10:08:58 pm
Agreed, Janro - I was sure that was Raxx's work when I saw the pic!

Glad you got the printer working, Raxx, it sounds pretty cool! I look forward to seeing some of the output.
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: Maximilianibus on March 07, 2012, 10:39:54 pm
i'd like to get a print, too ^^
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: Raxx on March 07, 2012, 11:05:29 pm
Aw, now I'm starting to feel bad about not modeling anything :P

Maximilianibus, you're added to the list and now there is 1 slot left!
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: headwax on March 08, 2012, 01:31:05 am
Heya Raxx, well my admiration for you just grows in leaps and bounds (2mm increments) :) What a marvelous thing you have done. It's wonderful to bridge the huge chasm between gunna and actually 'do' - and it looks like you have done a magnificent job!

Thank you for your kind offer! I'm not sure if I have anything worthy at the moment :(.
Really looking forward to what $imon et all come up with.

heck, it's not often I wish I were rich - or smart enough to make something like this!
but this time I do....

!
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: Raxx on March 08, 2012, 04:54:07 am
Well headwax, you have a spot reserved regardless, if you have a model you'd like to see in real life you can email it to me and I'll do the conversion work for you. Special treatment due to that challenge way back that you won third second place in ;)

As for costs and smarts, well. If you are patient and hunt down good deals then you can build one for around $400. But as time goes by, newer versions of the reprap are being developed where they are cheaper and easier to build. I'm sure one day you will have a printer sitting on your desk.

As it happens, I had printed a model out a few months ago, before I had to take a break from the printer. I believe the layer height was around 0.3mm, so know that more than likely the level of detail will be 1.3 times better (assuming your models are printed at 0.2mm)

(http://the-meadow.net/prusa/dog1.jpg)

(http://the-meadow.net/prusa/dog2.jpg)   (http://the-meadow.net/prusa/dog3.jpg)

The dog model was a quick sculpture done in sculptris that was then poly-reduced to make the slicing program run faster. After it printed I tested my airbrush on it, resulting in the...um...spectacular paint job.
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: $imon on March 08, 2012, 08:00:13 am
Hey Raxx, sorry to hear about the broken piece!
Not so sorry too because now we have some more time ;)

You said you reduced the poly amount before printing for the dog, is a high poly count a problem? What would you say is about an acceptable limit for the models to be printed?
I think the dog came out pretty cool!
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: ENSONIQ5 on March 08, 2012, 10:53:21 am
This is a truly awesome concept, and it's awesome of you to offer to construct members' models, Raxx.  I have gone through all my models and none that would be worthy of reality meet the angle criteria, even after breaking them up.  Apparently I have a predilection for stupid levels of detail and complexity!  However, I am fascinated by this concept and I am looking forward to seeing images and videos.  A researcher I work with has built a very similar machine, he works with a larger (big $$$) machine which is used to model mathematical concepts (I know, bizarre right?) but wanted a small, cheapish machine to play with.  He has managed to do some pretty amazing things with it and recently managed to print the logo of the organisation we work for in two colours, blue and white, swapping over the filament between the colours.  He has posted time-lapse videos and images on our internal chatter system, I'll see if I can get them off and post them here for interest's sake.
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: Janro on March 08, 2012, 12:26:00 pm
Like ENSONIQ, I went through the models I had in store and well they don't quite meet the requirement. I might try and model a character of mine with that in mind, but it'll be the first time I'd do without a rig. I never really did flat out sculpting before.

P.S. (and really off topic sorry >< ) I forget, I want to share some work just to show what I've been up to, but it's not done in Anim8or. Do we have a place here for that?
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: Raxx on March 08, 2012, 05:29:30 pm
$imon: I had a feeling that statement would bring up questions ;) A complex model simply takes longer to slice. As far as I know, there could be a couple of million polygons and it wouldn't hang up, it'd just take a while depending on how many layers it has to slice the model into and the kind of fill pattern it'll use. After the poly reduction, the dog was still in at around 26k triangles. Time-wise it's not much of an issue since there will be a lot of downtime while waiting for the models to print, and I can do other stuff in the meantime.

ENSONIQ5: Yeah filament swapping for different colors is cool, but not entirely accurate just yet, and I don't have any other color at the moment. There is some work being tested on making a multi-color extruder, you can see their attempts so far here (http://blog.reprap.org/2012/02/print-any-colour-you-like.html). I'll reserve a spot for you just in case, even if you know someone personally that owns a printer.

Janro: Well you can show off your work in the Finished Works and Works in Progress board, or here in the General Anim8or board. As you may have noticed I've posted a few topics regarding 3D related projects here in the past. In my opinion, seeing how other Anim8or users are applying CG to their work makes for an interesting read regardless of if it's made in Anim8or or not.

Also, you don't have to do sculpting if you don't want to. Anything modeled traditionally will work just as well as a sculpted model. I just used sculptris because it suited my needs at the moment.

I'm willing to do the conversion work for both ENSONIQ5 and Janro since you guys also won that challenge way back when, if you have a favorite model that you want printed but aren't sure about the work it'll take to prepare it for printing. You two can email it to me and I'll do it for you.

I figured I'd put together something that might interest you guys on how a sliced model looks in the client program that's used to send the instructions to the printer. One of the programs I use has a neat feature that shows what it looks like with all the layers stacked up. It's basically a preview of the real thing, assuming that the print goes smoothly. So if you want to see what it might look like, with what kind of detail, I have no problem with posting a screenshot of your model like this for you to see. The above picture is the original one that I printed with the 0.38mm layer height.

(http://the-meadow.net/prusa/dog_layers.jpg)

Below is an animation of what the sliced dog looks like, layer-by-layer. The black lines are the lines that the printer will be following while extruding the melted plastic. For this one, the inside fill density has been set at around 0.5, using a pattern that promises good support.

(http://the-meadow.net/prusa/dog_layers.gif)

And the picture below is a comparison of 0.2mm(on the left) to 0.38mm(on the right). The one on the right was sliced a few months ago using a less capable slicer, the one on the left was done at the time of this post and took around 15 minutes to slice the model into 357 layers. As you can see the quality is a lot better for the 0.2mm one.

(http://the-meadow.net/prusa/dog_layers_close_th.png) (http://the-meadow.net/prusa/dog_layers_close.png)
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: $imon on March 10, 2012, 11:38:04 am
Unfortunately I did not have too much time to make something too detailed. Fortunately it only has to be a model not fully textured etcetera.. so I made this piece. I hope it meets the specifications for printing?

Thanks again Raxx for the amazing offer ! :) And I hope you will have the printer up and running again soon!
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: cooldude234 on March 10, 2012, 09:41:00 pm
Well I drew up my concept image to use as the reference image while modeling, still going to add to it, when I decide what I want to add to it :P

Since I have march break off (YAY!), I can actually put effort into the quality :P
(unlike the sloppy concept I drew)
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: Raxx on March 11, 2012, 12:43:01 am
$imon: Aw, and here I was hoping you'd want to print something like this (http://i52.tinypic.com/1679r28.jpg), or any one of your other challenge entries ;)

Well, your model gave me all sorts of problems, but I got it sliced. Since it's such a large print with not quite as much detail, I might print it at about 0.5mm per layer to save time. Dimensions are approx 168x171x98mm. Sliced at 0.2mm, the estimate was 497 layers, taking 16 hours to print. Sliced at 0.5mm, it's 197 layers at 8 hours. And that's with no infill, so it'll probably take about 2 or 3 times longer than that. Image below of it sliced at 0.5mm:

(http://the-meadow.net/prusa/$imon1_layers.jpg)

Let me know if you want to keep this or have a go at a different model!

cooldude234: Looks complicated! Is this a top-down kind of view of the print you're wanting, or are you going to split it up? Good luck with the rest of the design!
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: cooldude234 on March 11, 2012, 03:29:01 am
Well, when its printing, you'd be looking at it, top down in the picture, but its a wall ordainment so it hangs from the wall the same way you are looking at it in the picture.
If my terrible explanation makes sense :P
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: Raxx on March 11, 2012, 06:35:03 am
Makes perfect sense, and it's a great idea! Remember the size limitations and such though. With all that detail packed in there, and with it not being any larger than 190mmx170mm, smaller details might disappear or become distorted, especially when flattened.

To show you what I mean, below is an engraving of a bull I found online and sliced. The top image shows what the original depth looks like. For the bottom image, the left side shows the sliced version, the right side is what it looks like as a 3D model. Each row shows it scaled in height (depth) by a certain amount. x1.0 is 13mm, x0.5 is around 6.5mm, and x0.25 is around 3.25mm. Each one has a layer height of 0.2mm, and a width and length of 170mmx170mm.

(http://the-meadow.net/prusa/bull_example.jpg)

(http://the-meadow.net/prusa/bull_example_layers_th.jpg) (http://the-meadow.net/prusa/bull_example_layers.jpg)

It doesn't look too bad, but if there are more details squeezed in to a shorter vertical space (flattened), or the layers have to cover more distance in less vertical space, jaggies and loss of detail between the model and the print will start appearing. That's because if the details are shorter than the layer height, that layer isn't going to show it. You can see these jaggies on the top of $imon's sliced tree trunk and on top of my dog's nose and head, and a bit in the picture above.

The loss of detail is evident as well. This concept may seem obvious when you flatten a 3D model, but it's not the same with a 3D print with a limited resolution. You can squint, change the lighting, or zoom in on a flattened 3D model and still see the detail. In a 3D print, no matter how hard you squint, that detail will be lost forever if it's too flat.

I'm not saying your idea can't be done! Far from it, but make sure when you're modeling these details that the details you want to stand out have a minimum height to actually be seen and distinguished in the print. You can also take advantage of the printed flat-detail effect you see in the x0.25 version if that's a style that interests you (takes a little more technical work to achieve, though)

Of course, I'm assuming you're flattening it into a plaque-like form...if it's all going to be fleshed-out, fully 3-dimensional detail (which will work just as well or better), then most of what I just typed doesn't apply. Just more info to soak in I suppose ;)
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: cooldude234 on March 11, 2012, 06:10:31 pm
Yea I know what you mean. I was going to make it like a plaque-like thing with 3d depth and detailing. I know that some detail would be lost, which is why when I'm done modeling it I would have it go through your opinion and let me know where are the places that would loose said detail.


PS you said something about limiting the amount of triangles, I'm assuming we are allowed to use triangles though. Would seem quite dumb to not be able to use em.
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: Raxx on March 11, 2012, 09:35:50 pm
That's fine, I'll be more than happy to help in that area.

In the end the model gets triangulated before being sliced, so any n-gon will work. But as far as the triangle/poly count there's not really a limit. $imon's tree trunk ran in at 36k triangles. The bull was 10k triangles, the dog was 26k, and just now I tested it on a 190k triangle model with no problems. As far as I know, the software doesn't have a cap on the triangle count.
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: cooldude234 on March 11, 2012, 11:55:18 pm
That's good, I'm not worried about having many polygons, but I do have a lot of triangles in the mesh.
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: $imon on March 13, 2012, 07:56:03 am
Raxx, hm.. I was under the impression that a model like the car would not be printable at all? because of the angles and the fact that its not manifold..
I made the other model too quickly I'll admit and you won't have to print that.. I just don't have time at the moment to make something good.
If you want to mess around with the car model to see how it would print I can send it to you if you want!

Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: 3Dgeek11 on March 13, 2012, 08:12:35 am
I'd hate to take the last place if someone else is planning on taking it… and I don't exactly have a ready model for this, but I will think about it.

Needless to say, this is an awesome offer, Raxx. And everyone's submissions so far look cool and I hope they turn out nice once printed. :)

But I do know exactly what I would have you print, I'd just need to remodel it since it's so outdated and probably wouldn't be up for printing as-is. It'd make my friends jealous if they saw I had a real model of this certain thing…

I'll see what happens. ^^
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: Raxx on March 13, 2012, 11:22:31 am
$imon: Sure! I'll take it out for a spin ;) Feel free to email it to me and I'll see what I can do with it.

3Dgeek11: I added you to the list! It's ok to take the last spot, if someone was planning on taking it then they should have posted for it ;)

No more spots left! Good luck with your models, guys. I received the hotend and installed it but I have some other issues with the printer to take care of, so the deadline's still set for Friday as far as I can tell.
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: Janro on March 14, 2012, 12:40:07 am
Busy busy busy ><

Deadline to give you the model is this friday right? What time is the deadliest deadline?

I have this portfolio class I'm working artworks on and I'm actually planning having one of those artworks be my potential model to be printed. But still in the planning stage. Trying to see if I can have a character of mine posed in such a way that it'd be printable. Thought you might like to know my plans since I've been silent the past few days.
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: 3Dgeek11 on March 14, 2012, 07:13:21 am
Okay, here's mine. It is a bit sloppy in some places, and I wasn't actively practicing this "45 degree rule" so it may not be printable, If it isn't, just tell me what's wrong and I'll fix it up.

It may not be final either, so yeah. Just tell me what you think of this. ;)
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: Raxx on March 14, 2012, 09:07:00 am
Janro: Well, the way I'm going to work the prints is that if on Friday my machine is fully functional then I will be printing in the order that people signed up. So it'll be $imon, cooldude234, siragin, Janro, Maximillianibus, and then 3Dgeek11. Depending on the print quality it may take up to a day for each print. Also, even though I'll be starting in this order, if someone's not ready when his turn comes up then he'll be placed in the back of the line for more time.

If after everyone else's prints have been done and you're still not ready, the time that I complete your print may be indefinite. I prefer not to be old and wrinkly when this offer's finished ;)

3Dgeek11: Star Fox's ship, eh? Well, your model in its current state isn't printable. The only way I can print it is for me to split it up into pieces and glue it all together, and it's not completely manifold (though I can fix that). For the most part this version of the Arwing has too many things sticking out everywhere so that it can't really be fixed up any other way. In fact, any version of the Arwing will have to be printed in pieces first and then stuck together, so that's really the only option.

If you're ok with that then I'll do it! I can't guarantee it'll be pretty but it'll at least have the proper shape ;) Also, if you want to add more detail to it, you have until Friday (or whenever your turn comes up) to do so.
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: 3Dgeek11 on March 14, 2012, 09:25:14 am
Okay, well then give me till Friday and I'll either give you a different model entirely, or touch up this one, and/or let you print it in pieces.

I just don't want to make it too much trouble! What you're doing is already very generous, especially shipping the models (which will be hard and long printing) to us. :p
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: Raxx on March 14, 2012, 10:03:53 pm
3Dgeek11: Don't worry about the trouble. This experience will benefit me just as much as you guys, with all the 3D printing and troubleshooting I have to do :P Besides, I figured I'd share the experience of having your art turned into a real-life paperweight ;)

$imon: I received your buggy, and it's doable! I'd do the audi but even though the main chassis is easier to print, it'll take a lot more work to prepare everything. Yours is first in the list so as soon as Friday surfaces I'll begin work and keep everyone updated.
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: 3Dgeek11 on March 16, 2012, 04:06:28 am
Well, since it's almost Friday I guess you can go ahead and try printing the Arwing I already posted. I can't make it look any better really.

If it's too much trouble, don't bother of course. It's all good, etc… You get it. ;)
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: siragin on March 16, 2012, 11:20:29 am
here is my model. if you need to slice him or what ever you can
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: Janro on March 16, 2012, 12:20:01 pm
Only now do I get my 'free time', or the closest I can get. Working on a few studies of this character I plan to print and the possible poses he'd be printed in. Will post it here when I'm done.
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: Raxx on March 16, 2012, 07:07:23 pm
3Dgeek11: I'll do that then. You still have a few days, technically, since it'll take a while to get to yours. So if you change your mind let me know.

siragin: Yours is going to be hard to do, so I'm going to have to try some different techniques to get him printed. He's extremely non-manifold, so I'll try a sampling technique to restructure him automatically into a manifold object. Also, to get the cape down, I'll have to split him in half at the waist and print him in two pieces. So long as I can get the first step done, it shouldn't be a problem.

Janro: Ok!



So, it took a while but I finally fixed all the stuff with the printer that needed work, and calibrated it (hopefully) well enough. Once I finish printing a test piece, I'll get started on $imon's buggy!

I set up a streaming web cam, so you can watch the printer live. It won't be very exciting since it's slow in real-time, but at least you can see the progress as it happens! If the image doesn't load below, then that means the server is down. Otherwise feel free to click on it.

Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: Maximilianibus on March 16, 2012, 07:20:49 pm
oowww stupid time. i almost forgot to post my model >_> is it possible to print this? if not i've got a serious problem >_<
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: Raxx on March 16, 2012, 07:28:59 pm
Yep, that one can be printed no problem. Is that all you wanted done?
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: Maximilianibus on March 16, 2012, 07:58:52 pm
jup, thats all :) thanks
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: Raxx on March 16, 2012, 09:54:07 pm
Maximilianibus: ok then. I'll print it then!

So I've begun working on $imon's buggy model so that it'll be printworthy, and figured I'd start with the wheels since they are easy enough and won't waste a ton of filament if something goes bad in these early stages.

(http://the-meadow.net/prusa/freebies/Simon/layers_backwheels.jpg)

I intend on making the wheels capable of rotating in the final print, so I had to make space to fit a 608 bearing in it (I have a few extra laying around from building the printer). The piece at the top of the image is the cap, the piece on bottom is the backside where the bearing will be placed. The two pieces will be attached back-to-back to back to form one wheel.

If you see an image below, that means the printer is running and you can click on the image to go to the live webcam of it in action. I'll post a timelapse later if it's successful.

(http://174.96.24.42:8080/shot.jpg) (http://174.96.24.42:8080/browser.html)
(do me a favor and don't mess with the controls--just watch :P)

[edit]Ok, round #2
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: Raxx on March 17, 2012, 03:25:14 am
Ok, today I couldn't do much since I had to finish a paper for school, but I almost succeeded in printing out the wheels.

As you can see in the image below, they printed to the proper proportions but there is a messy blobbing effect caused by irregular extrusion of the plastic. My first observation related to this is that for some reason the hotend is fluctuating in temperature about 10-15 degrees constantly, likely because of an issue with the firmware. The hotter it's melted the more there will be extruded (blobbing up if it's too hot).

(http://the-meadow.net/prusa/freebies/Simon/backwheels_attempt1.jpg)

Also, it didn't help that eventually one of the motors overheated and started pausing every so often, which totally messed up some of the prints (frustrating to deal with). I've since placed a fan on it and it seems to be maintaining a lower temperature, so hopefully that issue is resolved.

So I'll probably be spending most of Saturday re-calibrating everything until the blobbing goes away. With my luck, when I'm finished with that something else will go wrong :P Also, I'm working on a better webcam solution. I've been using my android phone, and it works great when it works, but seems to close itself out after a little while for no apparent reason (probably overusing the phone's resources since there's so much processing involved).

So these are the current issues I'm working on, I'll keep you guys updated.
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: headwax on March 18, 2012, 09:25:06 am
Hey Hey Raxx, they look good enough to eat :)

Thanks for the update, it's so cool to watch something coming from a pile of verticies and turning into a real object/ Bloddy amazing :)
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: Raxx on March 18, 2012, 08:42:34 pm
Hey headwax, thanks :) You've still got a spot reserved in case you want something printed (though at this rate, it'll be a few months before your turn comes -_-)

It seems that for every print I complete, I have to spend 4 hours fixing something. This time after fixing most of the blobbing issues and printing the below piece (much better quality!), the filament got jammed in the extruder and I had to take it apart, and it's stripping the filament every time I try a print now. I think I have the solution for that, we'll see :P

(http://the-meadow.net/prusa/freebies/Simon/backwheels_attempt2.jpg)

By the time I'm done with all of your prints, I'll be one of those wise old men in the reprap IRC channel ;)
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: Modeler_in_the_Myst on March 18, 2012, 09:51:48 pm
Aye, what ye would'na give fer a good replicator?
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: Raxx on March 18, 2012, 10:09:13 pm
Modeler_in_the_Myst: What I wouldn't give for a good reprap and a good webcam solution :P This time instead of the camera dying, the laptop quit recording from it. Grr!

Anyways, the second wheel is finally printed. Below is what the parts look like with the 608 bearing inside it. Boring, I know. Don't worry, once these wheels are done I'll be starting on the main chassis ;)

(http://the-meadow.net/prusa/freebies/Simon/backwheels_attempt2_final.jpg)

Starting on the front wheel. Nothing complicated, will have a bearing inside it as well. The hard part will be building the caps that hold the wheel to the chassis and still allow it to rotate.

(http://the-meadow.net/prusa/freebies/Simon/layers_frontwheels.jpg)
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: Raxx on March 19, 2012, 12:24:32 am
Ok, the front wheel printed with no problems (would show a picture but I'm moving on)

It took a few hours, but the front chassis is ready to print! Supposed to take around 22 hours according to the estimate. I'm going to hope that's a very pessimistic estimate :P

(http://the-meadow.net/prusa/freebies/Simon/layers_frontchassis.jpg)

I'll try to have the webcam working but I don't know if it'll stay running the entire time. Click on the image below to go to the video feed.

(http://174.96.24.42:8080/shot.jpg) (http://174.96.24.42:8080/browser.html)
(do me a favor and don't mess with the controls--just watch :P)
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: $imon on March 19, 2012, 09:42:43 am
Nice work Raxx! Seems like you are having a lot of fun with it :) Im glad you can use the model!
It's amazing how many layers it prints. It must go through a lot of material! I'm sorry to hear that there are so many hiccups in the system though. I guess that's part of the 'fun' of building your own printer I guess ;)

I'm curious to see how the front wheel will be attached to the chassis..
(the webcam links are not really working - maybe I am looking at the wrong times.
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: ENSONIQ5 on March 19, 2012, 11:18:47 am
I was able to watch the webcam feed (mesmerising!).  Brilliant job embedding the bearings in the wheels!
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: cooldude234 on March 20, 2012, 01:14:35 pm
I was able to watch the webcam feed (mesmerising!).  Brilliant job embedding the bearings in the wheels!

How did you get the webcam feed? I don't see no link
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: dwsel on March 20, 2012, 01:36:49 pm
How did you get the webcam feed? I don't see no link
It was available yesterday. It was fun to watch :)

@Raxx
I wasn't expecting that the model that was printed was filled inside. Have you tried to print out thin shell and fill it later with some other material? It might speed printing such model a lot, and make the model more solid and durable.
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: Raxx on March 20, 2012, 08:30:50 pm
Yeah, my webcam's a little finicky so it had a lot of random up- and down-times. I'm glad at least a few people got to watch it.

So, I have some good and bad news regarding the last print. The bad news is that about two-thirds the way through I was trying to adjust it for height clearance while it was printing and the usb cord popped out, halting the print. There is no "resume" option (not really), but the good thing about this kind of printing is that you can just make a new object starting from approximately where it left off, print it, then piece it together. Below is the good news:

The part that printed before it got interrupted
(http://the-meadow.net/prusa/freebies/Simon/chassis_fr_1.jpg)

(http://the-meadow.net/prusa/freebies/Simon/chassis_fr_2.jpg)

(http://the-meadow.net/prusa/freebies/Simon/chassis_fr_5.jpg)

The end piece
(http://the-meadow.net/prusa/freebies/Simon/chassis_fr_6.jpg)

What it'll look like glued together
(http://the-meadow.net/prusa/freebies/Simon/chassis_fr_3.jpg)

(http://the-meadow.net/prusa/freebies/Simon/chassis_fr_4.jpg)

You can see a few darker blemishes caused by burned plastic (probably just some "self-cleaning" that eventually happened). It might prompt me to just go ahead and plaster, sand, paint, and finish the entire thing. Depends ;)

I'm extremely satisfied with these results. This was the largest print I've ever attempted, and it was running for practically 24 hours non-stop. The detail is excellent for what it's doing, and it's pretty solid and heavy, even at 60% infill density.

I managed to capture the last bit of the print, and I'll post a link to the timelapse as soon as it's up and running.

Dwsel: As you can see in the third image, I did hollow it out a bit to speed it up. Due to time constraints and worries about the 45 degree rule, it wasn't completely optimal. I'll definitely be experimenting with a more "shelled" version with the back chassis part since it's going to take even longer to print.

Ok, future plans: I'll print the rest of the front wheel pieces, and then I may need to wait until the weekend before I will print the back piece, since I don't like leaving the printer unattended and there's a lot of prep work to do for it.

$imon, you wanted to know how I intend to attach the front wheel to the chassis, hopefully this picture will clear that up:

(http://the-meadow.net/prusa/freebies/Simon/concept_frontwheels.jpg)

All of the pieces will be glued together into a rigid structure, then glued to the shaft that'll run through the 608 bearing. The shaft will also be glued to the inside of the bearing, with the wheel spinning freely. Unfortunately that means it can only roll in a straight line, but I didn't have enough time to design anything more complex that'd work when printed :P
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: $imon on March 20, 2012, 09:19:12 pm
Oh really nice Raxx! I like how the detail turned out on that front part! I'm glad it's working properly and that your work has paid off so far..

I hope the front wheel attachment will be rigid enough to carry the weight? I guess the load is not that heavy..

Really awesome looking so far + I can't wait to see what's next!
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: 3Dgeek11 on March 20, 2012, 09:23:08 pm
Wow, it does look fantastic! This is really cool.
Looking forward to the timelapse.

And a shame about the cut-off, but at least you found a way around it. ;)
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: Raxx on March 21, 2012, 01:46:32 am
$imon: Thanks :) As for the load, it'll be a little heavy and it should be enough, but I don't have the info to compute if it would fail or not. This is basically the laziest, worst sort of engineering ;) I'll test it before the build is set in stone, however, and I have a few options in mind to fix some potential problems with the green part being connected to the chassis in that manner.

3Dgeek11, thanks! Assuming it happens again, which seems inevitable in some way, I'll try to "rig" it to resume printing from where it left off.

I've finished the timelapse:


Future timelapse vids should look a lot better in resolution once I switch to just taking pictures every X seconds.
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: Raxx on March 24, 2012, 07:33:25 am
Ok, finally got the next piece prepped and ready. I figured what the heck, I'll do the worst first. Below is the layer shot. The back doors panel will be glued onto the top. As you can see, I'm completely shelling this piece to save time and filament.

(http://the-meadow.net/prusa/freebies/Simon/layers_bk_chassis_1.jpg)

Unfortunately, the back part of the wheel opening *might* not print out well due to violating the angle rule. Dunno, we'll see on the 13th hour of the print :P

I'm trying out some new timelapse software for my phone, so hopefully it'll be a lot more consistent with better picture quality this time. No more live webcams, though.
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: Raxx on March 25, 2012, 11:25:11 am
I'm not too happy with this print. I had reduced the extruder output by a fraction to see if it would fix a possible problem with layer height, and it's slightly on the sour side of having too little extrusion: a lot of threads and garbage, and possibly less structural integrity. It's still good enough quality though, and can be cleaned up, so thankfully I won't be reprinting it. I did however discover that there is a slight warping effect that occurs during the cooling stage, which seems to only happen for large prints, so the two large pieces don't quite mesh together to make seamless connection; rather, there are some gaps at the edges. So I'll probably be doing a patching and painting job on it after all.

Pictures:

(http://the-meadow.net/prusa/freebies/Simon/chassis_bk_1.jpg)

(http://the-meadow.net/prusa/freebies/Simon/chassis_bk_2.jpg)

(http://the-meadow.net/prusa/freebies/Simon/chassis_bk_3.jpg)

Timelapse:
Youtube (http://youtu.be/Ggt6r0BKcTs)

I've got to remember next time to rotate the model so that it'll print with the more interesting view pointed at the camera ;)
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: $imon on March 25, 2012, 12:00:21 pm
Despite the warping, I think it still looks amazing!  Great to see the details on the side are kept so well..

It seems like it's worth it to print it shelled instead of solid, saving a lot of filament.

Awesome project, Raxx! :)

It's up to you how far you would like to take it with patching and painting ;) It'll be awesome either way!
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: Raxx on March 25, 2012, 09:16:33 pm
Thanks $imon. I'm ever the perfectionist so I'm not going to be satisfied until it looks like your rendering of it ;) I'll probably do a timelapse of the assembly process too, but I probably can't start it until next weekend.

(http://the-meadow.net/prusa/freebies/Simon/layers_backdoorspanel.jpg)

Currently printing the back doors panel (only a 5 hour job). Once that's done, all that's left is the front wheel mechanicsm, mirrors and handles, license plates, and the wheel shafts!

By the way, siragin, assuming you read this post...I've tried all sorts of methods to resample and remesh your model but it's just not working. Since you've converted the subdivided model into a mesh and violated all the specifications for a successful print, I won't be able to fix it without losing my sanity. Please either fix it yourself, give me the original unsubdivided model so I can fix it myself, or choose a different model for me to print. Thanks!
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: cooldude234 on March 25, 2012, 10:43:53 pm
Say, how much did it take to build your reprap Raxx?
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: Raxx on March 26, 2012, 02:21:12 am
cooldude234: Too much for someone on a college budget ;)

Ok, the print finished. But much to my dismay, it turns out the X-Axis is reversed! All these prints and tests I've done, and not one of them has been asymmetrical until now. Figures. I kind of worried about it but I hoped for the best in this one :P Depending on $imon's verdict I may have to reprint it if the license plate location is critical. Rest assured I'm going to fix the issue with the printer asap.

(http://the-meadow.net/prusa/freebies/Simon/backdoors.jpg)

I did run into some hiccups. Namely my computer went to sleep and the print halted while I was grocery shopping. However, I managed to dive into the existing g-code and adjust it so that it picked up from where it left off, so it's all good ;)

Youtube Timelapse:
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: $imon on March 26, 2012, 07:14:05 am
Haha that's fine Raxx, a minor detail that doesn't really matter. Looking great though :) I like the small details on the back there.

It's amazing to see it come together in the timelapses too!
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: davdud101 on March 26, 2012, 11:33:34 pm
Man, Raxx, I must admit I've been watching the progress of this thread of the past coupla weeks, and MAN, that's some sweet stuff. Cool to see $imon's model (looks to be) coming out so well, at least to me. The timelapses certainly do help visualize the whole process. Really sweet, dude, I'll definetly keep up with the progress on this thread!
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: Janro on April 20, 2012, 06:41:47 am
Yay! Now that I'm on break and my body has rested from a bloody term I can think of what model to print now...

I'll just have to figure out what. I kind of want a character to be printed but, what would that entail Raxx? Is it better if I try to model and post it in such a way for it to come out in one piece or is it more efficient for it to be done in parts?
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: Raxx on April 20, 2012, 06:55:10 am
If it's near the proportions of a human, it is probably a lot more effective for it to be provided in parts. Not only does this mean it can be printed at a larger resolution, but appendages are tricky and doing it in pieces ensures that you can use almost any pose possible.

Be careful with the hands and other extremities or tiny details that stick out a lot. Try giving the character rock or paper hands, not scissors (if you get what I mean). Make sure everything is manifold. That is, one mesh with no overlapping polygons or holes.

It's a lot of specifics, but that's just how it is with this kind of printer ;) By the way, I've had to take a break from it due to school and some enhancements I intend to do to the printer before I begin printing again. Once summer break comes up in two weeks, I'll be on a roll!
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: lppena on April 20, 2012, 03:22:25 pm
Okay, here's mine. It is a bit sloppy in some places, and I wasn't actively practicing this "45 degree rule" so it may not be printable, If it isn't, just tell me what's wrong and I'll fix it up.


It may not be final either, so yeah. Just tell me what you think of this. ;)

Very cool model 3Dgeek11. Would it be okay to modify and use your model for my Battlezone video game? It looks like it would make an awesome aircraft type for BZII. Let me know okay? Leroy.
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: 3Dgeek11 on April 20, 2012, 09:40:59 pm
Okay, here's mine. It is a bit sloppy in some places, and I wasn't actively practicing this "45 degree rule" so it may not be printable, If it isn't, just tell me what's wrong and I'll fix it up.


It may not be final either, so yeah. Just tell me what you think of this. ;)

Very cool model 3Dgeek11. Would it be okay to modify and use your model for my Battlezone video game? It looks like it would make an awesome aircraft type for BZII. Let me know okay? Leroy.

Yeah, it's modeled after the game series Star Fox so it's not like I hold any rights.
So feel free. I bet an Arwing would be cool in BZII!
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: lppena on April 20, 2012, 10:41:15 pm
 :) Thanks 3Dgeek11, BZII recently added AI support for the aircraft class, so the computer team can fly and operate the models. It's always best to ask for permission when using other artists work. I'm beginning to produce more advanced models with Anim8or, and getting myself used to the modeling tools. I'm thinking that I'll use A8 in conjunction with TS for some of the work like UV mapping, and possibly animating my models; it's awfully hard getting completely away from using Truespace. I may eventually write some sort of TS COB or SCN exporter, so I would be able to import my Anim8or models directly into TS. Currently, I can import A8 models into TS using several A8 supported formats including the X exporter that Raxx fixed up for me; 3DS and OBJ are also supported.
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: Janro on April 21, 2012, 02:50:47 am
@Raxx: How would the appendages be attached together? I presume we'd stick it together ourselves right?

I saw the pictures but I'm curious, is the texture of the printed object like how it looks or is it somehow smoother than it seems?
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: CoriDavis on April 21, 2012, 02:27:37 pm
Janro- There's a 3D printer in my Engineering class at school. The texture is pretty rough to me.  It pretty much feels like hard sandpaper. Hey that's a good idea, sand it and it might be smoother! (if it doesn't ruin the color)
Edit: actually this is a different kind of printer so it might be different. The one we have is the kind that uses the glue and powder
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: cooldude234 on April 21, 2012, 10:10:28 pm
actually this is a different kind of printer so it might be different. The one we have is the kind that uses the glue and powder

Those ones are EXPENSIVE!! and they take a lot of material.
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: CoriDavis on April 22, 2012, 01:01:31 am
Must be why we only have one. lol
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: Raxx on April 25, 2012, 07:57:35 pm
Whoops, thought I replied here Janro...yes, you can stick it together yourself, or I can do it, whichever. The texture is pretty much how it looks. It's not extremely rough, but you can run your fingernail across the surface and feel each groove. So the larger the better, though if it's too large then I may not be able to make it ;)

It'll take a little bit of work to give it a decent surface and paint job, but that may be worth it depending on how much you like your 3d art...

[edit] I finally decided to test sanding it down. It turns out that if you use 220 grit sandpaper, you can successfully smooth down the surface so that there aren't the ridges from the layers anymore. It clouds the surface so that it's no longer shiny in the areas that's sanded, but you can always prime and paint it easily using spray paint or an airbrush, thus giving it a consistent surface. You can go over it with finer grit sandpaper after the 220 initial sweep, to give it a smoother surface and therefore better quality paint job, if you're really into it...
Title: Re: Free offer to print your model!
Post by: Janro on May 01, 2012, 06:33:33 am
Hmmm sounds promising.I guess it's time for me to get back to figuring out what to have printed xD

Good grief, I never knew I could be so indecisive ><